‘We chose peace, they chose proxy war’: PM Modi on India-Pakistan relations on podcast with Lex Fridman

In a podcast with

Lex Fridman

, Prime Minister Narendra Modi spoke in detail about India’s troubled relationship with Pakistan while calling out the neighbouring country for

state-sponsored terrorism

and failed

peace efforts

.
The discussion, which was part of a three-hour-long podcast episode released on Sunday, explored India's historical ties with Pakistan, past attempts at fostering diplomacy and PM Modi’s vision for the future of

bilateral relations

.
Fridman asked the Prime Minister about the tense conflict between the two nuclear-armed nations and whether he saw a path to friendship and peace.
PM Modi responded by recalling India’s partition in 1947, describing it as a painful and bloody chapter in history. He explained that despite India's acceptance of partition, Pakistan did not choose peaceful coexistence.

"After getting their own way, we expected them to live and let live, and yet, they chose not to foster a harmonious coexistence. Time and again, they decided to be at odds with India. They have waged a

proxy war

against us," PM Modi said in the podcast.
He accused Pakistan of exporting terror, saying that India is not its only victim — terrorist activities linked to Pakistan have impacted the entire world.
"Wherever terror strikes in the world, the trail somehow leads to Pakistan. Take the September 11 attacks, for example. The mastermind behind it, Osama bin Laden—where did he eventually emerge from? He had taken refuge in Pakistan. The world has recognized that in a way terrorism and the terrorist mindset are deeply rooted in Pakistan," he said.
PM Modi further called Pakistan an "

epicentre of turmoil

", urging its leadership to "abandon the path of terrorism" and work towards peace. He also mentioned that the people of Pakistan themselves long for peace, as they have suffered from years of internal unrest and terrorist violence.
PM Modi on India’s past peace efforts
When Fridman asked Modi about past attempts to improve India-Pakistan relations, PM Modi recalled his historic invitation to Pakistan’s then-Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif for his swearing-in ceremony in 2014.
"My first attempt at improving bilateral relations was when I invited my Pakistani counterpart to my swearing-in. It was a gesture of goodwill, a diplomatic gesture unlike any in decades," he said.
He also elaborated on his surprise visit to Lahore in 2015, aimed at fostering better ties between the two countries. However, he lamented that every peace initiative was met with hostility and betrayal from Pakistan.
"Yet, every noble attempt at fostering peace was met with hostility and betrayal. We sincerely hope that wisdom prevails upon them and they choose the path of peace," PM Modi added.
Modi’s discussion with Fridman is part of the American podcaster’s globally popular show, which has featured influential figures like Elon Musk, Volodymyr Zelenskyy, Mark Zuckerberg and Jeff Bezos.
Fridman had earlier described the interview as “one of the most powerful conversations” of his life.